How to Handle Terminations with Empathy and Humility

Episode 84

Terminations don’t have to end in burned bridges or blindsided employees. HR specialist Morgan Benson shares how empathy and humility transform difficult exit conversations. Tune in to learn how to deliver tough feedback while keeping dignity intact.

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Guest

Morgan Benson (sPHR)

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About the Guest

With humble beginnings, an open mind, and a genuine passion for people, Morgan Benson is an emerging Human Resources Business Partner committed to creating inclusive, supportive, and people-centered workplaces. Guided by empathy, integrity, and a willingness to learn, Morgan approaches human resources with the belief that an organization's greatest strength lies in the people who bring its mission to life. Recognizing that every individual has a unique story, perspective, and set of experiences, Morgan believes effective human resources extends beyond policies and procedures. It requires listening with intention, leading with compassion, and understanding the human side of business. This perspective shapes an approach to HR that balances organizational goals with the needs, well-being, and professional growth of employees.

Summary

Navigating employee terminations requires balancing organizational standards with genuine human empathy. HR professional Morgan Benson shared actionable strategies for conducting compassionate separation conversations, mitigating shock, leveraging cognitive psychology to soften difficult feedback, and protecting HR wellbeing.

Why Elimination of Surprise Is Crucial in Employee Exits

A successful termination process hinges on clear, documented performance management well before the final meeting takes place. When managers outline an improvement plan with transparent consequences, an exit should never catch an employee off guard.

Clear performance milestones: Outline specific improvement goals alongside the explicit outcome that failure to improve leads to termination.
Managing emotional reactions: Even when employees anticipate a termination, shock, anger, or grief can still surface due to the abrupt loss of primary income.
Addressing entitlement: Exceptional individual performance does not exempt employees from behavioral or cultural expectations; boundaries must apply universally.

How Humility Differs From Arrogance During Exit Meetings

Entering a termination meeting with an air of arrogance escalates tension, while humility de-escalates conflict by keeping the conversation grounded and respectful.

Acknowledge mutual fallibility: Framing the issue around human fallibility (“I’m not perfect, and we don’t expect perfection from you either”) prevents the employee from feeling completely dehumanized.
Validate the disruption: Acknowledge the gravity of losing a livelihood without becoming defensive or patronizing.
Maintain emotional composure: Remaining calm and steady provides an emotional anchor when meetings become tense or tearful.

Structuring the Firing Conversation: The Compliment Sandwich & Memory Effects

Terminations for cause often trigger feelings of deep personal inadequacy. Utilizing a structured “compliment sandwich” helps departing workers leave with their dignity intact.

Opening: Recognition –> Reiterate core strengths and past contributions.

Middle: Constructive –> Clarify why the fit failed and offer growth areas for future roles.

Closing: Appreciation –> Express sincere gratitude for their tenure and part ways cleanly.

This method aligns directly with primacy and recency effects—the cognitive tendency for individuals to remember the first and last pieces of information delivered. Framing critical feedback between sincere praise ensures the separation conversation closes constructively rather than punitively.

Internal Pivots: Preventing Turnover Before It Happens

Because employee turnover is expensive, organizations should assess alternative roles before initiating a formal termination.

Realigning job duties: If an employee expresses frustration with specific tasks but demonstrates aptitude in others, investigate department transfers.
Assessing role fit: Distinguish between a skill/role mismatch and systemic poor performance. Reassigning an employee to an area where they naturally thrive preserves organizational investment.

Essential Career and Mental Health Strategies for HR Leaders

Managing high-stakes workplace conflict requires resilience and mental compartmentalization.

1. Build Thick Skin and a Sense of Humor

High-stress HR events will linger into evenings and weekends if personal boundaries are absent. Maintaining humor and mental boundaries prevents emotional exhaustion and burnout.

2. Focus on Continuous Momentum

Career progression is not defined by speed, but by sustained effort. As long as an individual keeps moving forward, progress is guaranteed.

Frequently Asked Questions

What is the core difference between a layoff and a termination for cause?

A layoff stems from operational, structural, or financial necessity where the business can no longer support a role, regardless of worker quality. A termination for cause is tied directly to sustained poor performance or policy violations.

How does the primacy and recency effect apply to performance feedback?

The primacy and recency effect states that people recall the beginning and end of an exchange most vividly. Sandwiching developmental critiques between genuine positive recognition helps the individual internalize growth points without feeling demoralized.

What should managers do when an employee reacts angrily during an exit?

Maintain a calm, empathetic demeanor and refrain from matching the employee’s heightened emotion. Acknowledge the validity of their feelings regarding the loss of income while remaining firm on the organization’s final decision.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Hi everyone and welcome to the Culture Profit podcast. Today we’re chatting with Morgan Benson. She’s like one of the nicest people, but also has a history of HR and her family. And today we’re getting down into some of the nitty-gritty of how do you know when it’s time to fire somebody? How do you keep people in line with those HR guard rail rails? And she has some great recommendations on that. So excited for today’s conversation and thanks for joining us, Morgan.

Morgan Benson (Guest): Hi. So happy to be here.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): And calling in all the way from Long Beach, California. We’re up in northern Utah, so a little jealous that you’ve got the warm weather going on, which is great. But I’m I’ll tell you everyone just a little bit more about Morgan as we get started here. So Morgan Benson is a human resource business partner at Williston Financial Group and is dedicated to creating inclusive people- centered workplaces. Believing an organization’s greatest strength lies in its people, Morgan focuses on the human side of business, moving beyond standard policies to listen with intention and balance company goals with the well-being and professional growth of every employee. So, Morgan, you’re doing some amazing things over there and we’re so glad to chat a little bit more. So, thanks for for being here today.

Morgan Benson (Guest): Yeah, thank you so much for having me. When I just I’m just been so excited all day.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): We’ve been looking forward to it, too. I’ve been excited for two weeks since I talked to you. So, or however it’s three weeks, however.

Morgan Benson (Guest): I know.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): But,

Morgan Benson (Guest): It doesn’t feel like that long.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): um I know it goes fast.

Morgan Benson (Guest): Good.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yeah. But no, we really are excited for the conversation and I I want you to tell our listeners about you mentioned to me that HR it almost like runs in your blood. It’s been something that’s been in your family for a long time. So tell us about that and what’s been your twist and take on your own career like making it your own not fully following whatever you know your mom did or your dad or whatever and and making HR your

Morgan Benson (Guest): Yeah. Well, I do have a very I guess customer service centric family, but my mother specifically um she went to the same alma mater as me, Cal State Dominguez Hills,

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Oh,

Morgan Benson (Guest): and she got the exact same degree as me,

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): that’s awesome.

Morgan Benson (Guest): which is human resources management. So, you know, I wanted to be like her so bad. So, I decided to follow in her footsteps, but um I do feel like my personality goes well with the profession. So, it was just an easy transition.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yeah. So, did you get the favorite child award?

Morgan Benson (Guest): No, it’s funny actually because we’re so much alike, we fight a lot.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Oh, man. So, it’s not the rewards and recognition, it’s the uh conflict resolution side. Huh.

Morgan Benson (Guest): Yes. But I do call her when I have like um a project I’m working on or something that I just can’t crack. I call her for her expertise and she’ll help me out.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): That is super cool. That’s great. Well, every every family relationship has its ups and downs and I mean those those experiences are such big learning lessons that we can take into any career really. So I think that’s awesome. and and tell us about like you had kind of mentioned to me that you’re interested in a future where you are leading being more actually working with individuals. Um but yeah, I’d love to hear more about that.

Morgan Benson (Guest): Yeah. So, as I craft out my niche in HR, I’d like to do more recruiting or more so management side as far as placing talent and making sure they’re that they stay. So, talent and retention. And the end goal, you know, when it’s all said and done would be to start my own staffing firm,

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Okay, that’s cool. Yeah, I think that’s amazing. And that’s not something that’s like way down the road, is it? Like you would love for it to be sooner rather than later, right?

Morgan Benson (Guest): definitely sooner rather than later, but I also want to take my time so that I can build it into what I want and not just, you know,

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yeah.

Morgan Benson (Guest): hurry up and get something out there.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yeah, definitely. And I think, you know, some people jump to the the consult consultation and fractional work before they’ve had the corporate side of of the career, but I think taking those steps where you can have those learning and growing experiences to really tailor and refine what you’re offering will be is awesome. So, yeah, a lot more learning

Morgan Benson (Guest): I feel like um what I’ve learned in my tenure in HR is will be applied better to staffing.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yeah. Yeah, that makes sense. And honestly, the staffing space is an area where expectation management is a big deal when it comes to performance and when you show up and what you’re

Morgan Benson (Guest): Mhm.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): doing because you could have people, you know, going to this company and then they’re placed at a different company doing something completely different. So let’s talk a little bit about, you know, managing expectations. How do you establish clear guidelines and and protocols for employees to follow?

Morgan Benson (Guest): I have a very I guess you could say straightforward approach. I like to ride that line between, you know, being like a scary disciplinarian and being just humble and someone you feel like you can talk to about anything. But at the same time, I want you to understand this is what it’s expected of you. This is what’s not going to be tolerated and this is the plan moving forward. So, I want you to feel open to be able to come to me with those problems and those issues, but still have that respect as, you know, I’m helping you progress in your career.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): that makes sense. And is it how much of that is like defined in a job description versus verbal communication? like how how are you balancing or is it like a behavior that happens where it’s like how does it like how does it manifest in application I guess.

Morgan Benson (Guest): I think it starts out with the company’s rules because you have to learn those first to be able to

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Okay.

Morgan Benson (Guest): apply them and enforce them and then it’s more so your style of being managed or your management. Like I said, I’m I like to be hands off and I like to give people the chance to figure things out on their own and if they need guidance, they can come to me. But, um, I try to let them figure it out. And whatever way you feel is best, I feel like we can work it out to, you know, the company satisfaction and yours.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yeah. Nobody likes being micromanaged.

Morgan Benson (Guest): Oh my gosh. No. We all have a nightmare.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): So, yeah. Yeah. Halloween’s I mean, we just had Halloween. I mean, in the future in the past since we’re recording before Halloween, but it’s getting released after. So, yeah. I mean, it’s that spooky time of year. So,

Morgan Benson (Guest): Mhm.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): so I I want to hear first, how do you establish clear guidelines and protocol for an employee? And then we’ll kind of get into how you figure out if it’s something where you need a fire or if you’re can if you can still foster that improvement.

Morgan Benson (Guest): So, first thing is a communication. You know, I’m letting you know this is what’s going to be happening moving forward. This is what’s expected of you, as I said earlier. Um, and then I’m going to expect you to uphold that. If there’s an instance where, you know, there’s like a oneoff and you did something that’s frowned upon or that we will not tolerate, my policy is that the last stand should be termination. I like to retain people as long as possible, especially if they’re competent in their jobs. I don’t want to fire you. So,

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yeah.

Morgan Benson (Guest): if we can come to some kind of consensus without me firing you, then that’s great. But as far as the way I manage, that’s the last step. Or you would just have to do something atrocious for me to fire you on the spot.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Right. Right. So I I guess with Williston Financialand maybe your own take, is it something where you have those those clear communications happening before instances arise or arise or before we need a PIP plan or um is it more like they get onboarded and then if something comes up it’s it’s like then you address

Morgan Benson (Guest): So, we do have a process. We do not document the verbal warning. So, the first thing we’re going to do, like I said, is we’re going to communicate. Hey, this is not okay. Please don’t do that again. Um, the second step would be a PIP. So me, you, the manager, we’re going to um outline the plan moving forward and how you should improve and basically saying if you do not improve then you could potentially be terminated. Um the last step would be the termination.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yeah, definitely that makes sense. And when it’s done right, like I’ve definitely seen when someone’s let go and it’s they’re so surprised, they’re shocked, they they haven’t received that communication that you’ve spoken about, and I’ve seen the other side where it gets to that conversation of someone being fired and the person’s like, “Yeah, I know.” And

Morgan Benson (Guest): Yeah, I’ve I’ve had both of those. You’re right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): So what would you say is the big difference between, you know, someone exiting the organization and it being as positive as possible versus the ticked off, I’m way mad person leaving the office.

Morgan Benson (Guest): you know, sometimes those two cross. It’s like almost like they know that they should be termed or fired, but they’re still upset that it actually happened. Um, so yeah,

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): The reality.

Morgan Benson (Guest): exactly. because they feel protected or just whatever the case. They, you know, some people feel like because they’re such good performers that they can kind of do whatever they want, which isn’t true either. So,

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yeah.

Morgan Benson (Guest): you know, in those instances, we just try to remain calm. Sometimes it is emotional. You know, people cry or, you know, they’re visibly angry and I get that because your primary source of income is ending. I’ve been there.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Mhm.

Morgan Benson (Guest): But I just try to be as empathetic as possible in the situation.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yep. Yeah. I like how you mentioned being humble because I’m sure an air if you had like an air of arrogance when you’re addressing a situation like this that’s obviously not going to go over well but to be like hey I’m not perfect. We’re not expecting you to be perfect either.

Morgan Benson (Guest): Mhm.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Um you know this situation happened and we we want to get better from here. We want to improve. That’s you know that’s what we’re all doing as humans. And so I think having that Yeah.

Morgan Benson (Guest): Absolutely.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): having the humility as as a part of of that conversation is is probably hugely effective. Yeah.

Morgan Benson (Guest): I hope so.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): And I thought of just kind of a follow-up question. So, we recently just did an episode all about layoffs which is a little bit differenti scenario where the company has to let go of a certain amount of people to continue operating. So it’s nothing like it’s not because of poor performance and so that conversation looks a little bit different. It’s still emotional. It’s a challenging conversation. There’s still the loss of income. all those things are intact and you want to help that person move forward in a productive way. But when someone’s being let go for cause, it’s a little different. And I think sometimes people can take it even more personal that they feel like they’re a failure,

Morgan Benson (Guest): Yeah.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): they can’t do anything, like they’re just not good enough. So, how do you approach the firing conversation to help that person move forward in a productive way?

Morgan Benson (Guest): Wow, that’s an indepth question. I would say that it’s so cliche, but I like to if it’s just me myself in the conversation, I like to do the compliment sandwich.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Okay.

Morgan Benson (Guest): So,

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yeah.

Morgan Benson (Guest): I tell them something that they’re amazing at and what we loved about them while they were here. And then I follow up with the things that, you know, they could use some work on maybe moving forward in their next role. And then, you know, wrap it up with, “Thank you for all that you’ve done here with this company.” Yeah,

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yeah. No, for sure.

Morgan Benson (Guest): it’s it’s going to be the end of our relationship.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yeah, there’s there’s a real I mean, I don’t think that’s cl cliche at all. There is a real strategy with that. You know, as humans,

Morgan Benson (Guest): All

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): primacy and recency are being are are the way that our brains work. And so the first thing we hear and the last thing we hear are really the things we remember the most.

Morgan Benson (Guest): right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): The middle thing obviously is important and hopefully they hear that enough to go make that work for improvement, right? But I I think I think it’s not it’s it’s not a cliche thing. It’s actually a great strategy. So I love that. Yeah. So Morgan,

Morgan Benson (Guest): honestly

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): what advice would you give our listeners to take ch charge of their own career dreams? You’re looking into the future for for kind of helping people in that way. So what what advice would you give them?

Morgan Benson (Guest): I would just say go for it. We live in a time where we have so many resources to generate income, social media, just any and everything you could think of to get that platform so to speak. So I would just say go for it. you literally have nothing to lose at the very basis of it. You can fall back on your day job or your 9 to5. But if you want to pursue, then literally nothing is stopping you. Um I have this quote. You know what? I’m not going to say the quote because I forgot it. But I just remember one of the laws of physics is if you keep

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): What the hell?

Morgan Benson (Guest): moving forward. Eventually, you’ll get to the destination. So, it doesn’t matter how fast you’re moving. If you keep going, you’re going to get there.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yeah, I mean that that’s a quote by itself. That’s awesome. I love that. Honestly, I mean I totally agree with you. If if you have a goal, just go out there and work for it and and uh make your dreams come true. Like you totally can make it happen. Yeah. And and that’s certainly something like in a firing conversation like I feel like you you’d be great at and and just like that’s a great strategy is like what are your goals? Maybe this wasn’t a fit for you.

Morgan Benson (Guest): right?

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): So what what do you want to do? Where where is your fit and and helping them explore that and and maybe even you know teaching them where to go to actually figure out what their goals are. So, I I think that’s awesome. And you can really tell, you know, when when someone’s ready to keep trying in the organization or maybe they’re not anymore and they need to move on and and their next thing could be better. Yeah.

Morgan Benson (Guest): Absolutely. And we do try to pivot. If someone told me, “Hey, Morgan, I don’t like doing this, but I really enjoy this aspect of the job. Can I switch departments?” Then that would absolutely be considered because, like I said, we we want to retain as much as possible.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Yeah, I think I think that’s an awesome goal for every company. Turnover is expensive.

Morgan Benson (Guest): Yeah.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): So, well, do you have any other advice um for anyone who’s trying to take their career to the next level or just any other thoughts as we’re wrapping up here that you’d like to share?

Morgan Benson (Guest): Well, I just feel like specifically with HR,

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Right.

Morgan Benson (Guest): you have to really have a thick skin and a good sense of humor because sometimes you come across situations and they might stay with you when you log off your computer or when you go home from work because they’re so just intense and you can’t let it get to you because it it it can and it will if you allow it to.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): That’s amazing and so true. That’s great advice. Thanks so much for your time today, Morgan. And if you find that exact quote, we’ll make sure to include that in our highlight article. But everyone feel free to connect with Morgan on LinkedIn. She really is so nice and and that was how we connected and were able to have this conversation which is amazing. So everyone stay tuned for next time. Yeah. Thank you. Thanks,

Morgan Benson (Guest): Thank you so much for having me.

Matt & Crista Vance (Co-host): Morgan. We’ll see you next time.

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