Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Welcome everyone to today’s episode on the culture profit. Here’s the question for today. How do you scale a healthy company culture without losing the human element? Today, SnapC founder Glenn Bostock joins us to share the story behind his book, A Human Business, and reveals his five core principles for building a caring, high-performing workplace culture. So, Glenn, thanks for joining us today.

Glenn Bostock (Guest) : Yeah, thank you, Matt. Thank Thanks,

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Of course, we’re excited for the conversation.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Crista.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): And before we begin, I want to share a little bit about Glenn. He is the founder of SnapCap, where he turned a small barn workshop into a thriving manufacturing company renowned for innovation, teamwork, and an uplifting culture that puts people first. He believes that a business is only as strong as the community inside it. That belief led to the creation of a human business, a practical framework any organization can apply to become more caring, collaborative, and high performing.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): So we want to hear about this book that you wrote and if you want to show it for those who can

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Oh, sure. All

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): go and tell your your journey to arriving at making this book number one

Glenn Bostock (Guest): right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): on Amazon.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Yeah. Yep. It’s got these cute little stick figures on there.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Amazing.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Um yeah so the book so your question is how did I arrive at the book? So I was so I’ve this is now my 44th year in business. So I started out as a proprietorship and then uh you know eventually we incorporated uh but we’ve always been in manufacturing and I went from a one-man woodworking shop in a barn to uh we have over 140 employees

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Very

Glenn Bostock (Guest): now and with two manufacturing locations in the US and Canada and I’m thank you and I’m 66 this year and uh if I

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): impressive.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): was if I was money focused because I’d be selling my business. Uh, but what I’m interested in is seeing the way that we’re running this business, seeing it go on beyond me.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): I can’t, I can’t make that happen. But I realize that if I don’t write it down, you know, I think I think we’ve all heard of companies where they’ll say, “Oh, that owner, that founder was so great. It’s never been the same since they left.” Right? And I thought, well, you need to have some sort of constitution or something written down if you want to have a chance of something continuing. So, I wrote the book originally for my employees and then people are like, “Hey, you know, this is pretty good. I think this would have universal appeal. So then we uh so then we aimed it for you know for the for more for the market for people that are trying to have looking to have an employee looking to have a company that has strong employee

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Okay. So,

Glenn Bostock (Guest): engagement.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): when we talked before, I didn’t realize that was kind of the genesis of the book. To me, that makes it even that much more intriguing because you were writing something that was for a very specific purpose to carry the business forward in the way that you wanted to with that per people first focus and then it became the public book after.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): That’s

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): I think that’s even more um intriguing. Honestly, to me it sounds like it’s your legacy.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): you wanted to pass this on as a way to institutionalize the culture that currently exists and to maybe help other companies achieve that same community centered business.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Yeah.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): That’s so

Glenn Bostock (Guest): I think I guess so.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): amazing.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Yep. Yeah. I never think that I hear that word legacy. It’s not Yep. I guess it is. I guess I don’t know. I don’t think my legacy is that important, but I do think that if you’re doing something productive that could help other people, it’s important to do what you can while you’re here.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Yeah. Yeah. Maybe big word,

Glenn Bostock (Guest): So that’s Yeah.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): but I think that is what you’re trying to do. You’re trying to pass on the experience that your employees have had under your leadership

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Yep. Yep.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): and trying to deliver.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Mhm.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): That’s just so and before we jump into some of the specifics of the book because I

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Yes.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): think those principles that you identified and uh mapped out are really important for everyone to hear. But in in the intro or the bio it talks about you having or building an uplifting culture

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Mhm.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): which building elevators that’s very uplifting I would love

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Yeah, at least for the for the riders,

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): it.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): the elevator sure

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Yeah. Exactly.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): is.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Exactly. You know some elevated thoughts and then you go down when you need some deep thinking going on.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Yeah.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): But can you tell us the beginning of your business and

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Try not to get the shaft.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): how like how that started and how you got to where you are with with the business

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Sure. Um,

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): itself?

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Sure. So, I would say that this business model has universal application now, but I didn’t. I didn’t go out to build a business model for anybody else’s business except for my own.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Uh so, basically my story is I’m a guy that struggled through school. I had a whole bunch of learning disabilities and uh you know I was known as the dumb kid for 12 years through elementary school and high school and the way the way they did school I don’t maybe they still do it this way uh What? cuz you know they’d they’d they’d rank you like who’s read the most books. They’d have you like let’s do our memorized poems that see who has the good memory. Uh the times tables all these like ranking things where you’re constantly being ranked and it’s a competition. And I I think the theory is that if you’re if you if you’re in competitive environment in the school,

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Yeah.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): it’s going to incentivize the dumb kids to all of a sudden become the leading smart kids. But I’ve never actually seen that happen. I just see the dumb kids feeling dumber and dumber as time goes on. And I used to get hives in school. And when I was an adult, I was in a very stressful situation.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): I got hives. I’m realizing, oh my gosh, those hives were stress. I didn’t know what caused it. But I hated school.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Wow.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): But what I did get out of school was uh years and years of experience of failure and struggle. And uh that that is a really helpful thing to have when you go out to start a business because you’re going to be experiencing a lot of struggle and have to contend with potentially failing. So I’m kind of a you know I can accept I’m willing to take pretty big risks because I’m you know pretty comfortable with failing. Um so that was the good part of school. Uh after school, I my buddy and I would work in our dad’s wood shops and we we would do pretty sophisticated

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Excuse

Glenn Bostock (Guest): construction things and building things and designing things after school, but that didn’t really matter. His nickname was Brainless. Mine was rejected because I was always out being tutored. And now he’s got his own manufacturing company.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): me.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): He’s in a company called Pedestal Source in Colorado.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Oh, wow.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): And I’m SNAP and I’m SnapC here in the US and Canada. And um when I went to college, I was able to pick what I was interested in, which by now is woodworking because that’s what our hobby was. And I excelled at it. And I got all A’s. I got into business. I started a business uh doing cabinet work. And all of a sudden, I went from being the identity of the dumb guy to a craftsman. I can’t tell you how great it was to have a new identity as a craftsman. I met this wonderful gal from Canada. We got married. I’ve got this business that I’m very attached to because I’m well, first of all, it’s fun going out, meeting with customers, designing stuff. Then I go back and build it. Then we’d go install it. And that went on for some time until we had kids.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): And then all a sudden money started to become more important. And um my dad had pointed out that he thinks serves a business in elevator remodeling. He was an associate in the elevator business. So I took my portfolio of kitchen cabinets and bookcases and went around the elevator maintenance companies

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Okay.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): and said, “Hey, hey, do you want me to remodel your elevators because it’s all woodwork?” And they’re like, “Absolutely.” And uh so I started I got quite busy doing that.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Wow.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): And eventually I stopped doing the woodwork and only focused on elevators and I went from working by myself for a couple of people to having about five or six employees remodeling elevators. Then we came up with a systematic way of remodeling elevators. We applied for a patent, got the patent and then Otis elevator saw our system and they gave us a national agreement uh to remodel elevators where we would make a kit and it would ship out to all the um elevator maintenance companies throughout North America.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): So it started slow and they worked with us. They sent us to their quality school and their the guy at the quality

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Wow.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): school, Mr. Ido said that the gold is the problems. If you can identify a problem, make a mistake and prove the problem. It’s just like it’s your single best way to improve your company.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Yeah.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): And um actually before before I met Mr. O actually I didn’t meet him but he had established the school before I learned from Mr. I had a worker who had messed up a job that got shipped to Mexico and we had to rebuild it. It hurt my reputation. It cost us money and I thought I’m going to yell at Bob because this will be really helpful because then he’ll know not to do this again and if I yell at Bob in front of everybody then everybody will know not to mess things up. So, I was using a similar tactic that I had experienced in school myself that had turned me off so much.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Uh, but that’s right. That’s right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Negative.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): And uh so I yell at Bob and then Bob quits. He wasn’t incentivized at all and he quit. So I had to give him a raise. I got him back in the boat and it’s like, well that’s not effective because all really all I was was a woodworker. I wasn’t trained in business. I didn’t know how to manage people and uh I was having trouble with my marriage as well. We were seeing marriage counselors and around that time I had seen this gentleman give a talk on uh being addicted to anger and resentment and I don’t know if I was addicted to anger and resentment but I knew I felt those things regularly. So, I went to his talk and he had this 12step approach to this and I I ended up going to see him and it turned out he was a um he was a retired parole officer. So his job was to work with people that egos were so big, it got them into prison.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): And his job was to get them back out into society. He pointed out that people are led by what they love. And uh and I knew for sure I I knew what I was led by what I love. I I love being known as a craftsman. And uh after spending time with him and um realizing anyway, it took quite a bit of time. I would tell him why I was right and he would explain why I was just thinking about myself. And I had a mind shift mindset to be focused and trying to figure out what lights up my wife and what lights up my employees. And here I had punished Bob for doing the work he loves doing. He actually was using my system that sent the job to um Mexico. Uh I should have been blaming myself, not Bob. So after I had gotten this training from Bob, I mean from Peter, uh Bob screwed up another job that went to Hawaii.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): This time I didn’t yell at Bob. Instead, I’m like, “Oh, I’m just curious about how did that happen?” and he said, “Well, I put the wrong material on. I didn’t know it was the wrong material. I just put on what you guys gave me.” So, I sent Bob to Hawaii with his wife for a week and they fixed the job in one day and then spent the rest of the week on vacation in Hawaii. You’ll never guess what was more incentivizing to Bob, getting yelled at or Hawaii,

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Why?

Glenn Bostock (Guest): right? So uh so I started a I I decided since people are led by what they love. And the other thing I realized is that in the prison system they control people in prisons by using a fear of fear of punishment. And I realized oh I was treating Bob like he was in prison. So I just decided I’m going to drop the punishment. I’m not going to use punishment anymore. I’m gonna and uh to make a long story short, well to finish that story, we’ve started a practice from working with Bob, we started a practice of doing incoming inspection on our materials.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): So we make sure it’s the right material, right,

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Thank

Glenn Bostock (Guest): defect free, and it’s probably saved me hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): you.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): So that vacation to Hawaii has been paid for many times. Um, and we ended up, so now what we do at SnapC is we actually reward people for mistakes because it lowers the fear and then when they bring up the mistake, then we include them in a process to like mistake proof it with the team. So they get a half an hour to an hour a day to improve our processes every day.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Mhm.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): And every day the management team goes around and looks at what’s going wrong. And uh Um, we have these values now of being kind, being authentic, and being useful. Being kind creates an environment where, you know, you can say what’s going wrong. And we actually do give people a ticket that whoever reports the most mistakes per month gets a reward. They spin a prize wheel.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): So, they might get an extra day of vacation or something.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): That’s

Glenn Bostock (Guest): And then um being authentic means you want to be authentic with what’s going right,

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): cool.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): what’s going wrong. And then we’re all focusing on being useful to the customer and to each other. So like that’s in a nutshell. We’re trying to make a community of work here. We hire people for the instead of hiring people for experience and uh for their experience, we’re hiring people for what they love to do. And we’re trying to match what they love to do with the work we need done here. And one of the things we want people to have is an interest in seeing their co-workers be successful. Now we don’t want a competitive atmosphere at work. We want a collaborative atmosphere.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Yeah, everyone wins individually and together. I think that’s that’s really important and rewarding the identification of

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): of uh mistakes. That’s very powerful and I I love those values.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Those definitely fit the culture and community that you’re building. That’s really neat. So Glenn, tell us a little bit more about the book itself and the five principles

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Sure.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): that you identified for creating this idealistic workplace

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Um, okay. Well, there’s five principles and they’re largely captured in

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): community.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): our values are those values of be kind, be authentic, be useful. The fifth principle in the book is to model your business after the human form. So if you think of your own if you know we all got up this morning, right? And hopefully we’re doing something productive with our lives. You know, a lot of us get paid for a job. It’s you could look at it like you’re b you’re you yourself are your own little factory. Uh you’re consuming food. You’re doing something useful. You’re getting paid and you get re you get paid in multiple ways, but one’s one’s actually getting paid. And if you got a pebble in your shoe, would you not stop and get the pebble out of your shoe?

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): I hope

Glenn Bostock (Guest): But most Yeah. But that’s not the way most businesses work. Most businesses uh so we’re using the way your

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): so.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): body uh operates. You know, you have this leadership team in your head with thoughts, but you’re not having to think about digesting food and breathing. All your departments know what to do automatically. Like they’re but they’re all trying to achieve the goal of you know the two of you got up to come do this podcast today and you got me here and we all used our minds to do that and um I think you you could use your body as a picture of how a really well-run organization could run. So that that pebble in your shoe, you stopped uh your management team, your nervous system told your leadership team in your head to stop and get the pebble out of your shoe and all of a sudden your foot became the leader temporarily. And it that’s a lot the way Toyota works. At the Toyota factory, any worker can stop the production line, then they’ll swarm the problem.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): They’ll do their best to prove it. Then they’ll start the line again and they produce nearly defect-free cars. Um so what but normally um the businesses that I know are like, well, we’re trying to hit a goal here. We’re we’re I know we’re walking, but we want to get to this place, you know, by you know, we’re we’re we’re looking at quarter quarterly earnings. So, we got to keep moving. I don’t care if we have a pebble in the shoe. You keep moving. I don’t care if you have rocks on your shoes. We’re not stopping. And it’s like some sort of form of a dictatorship with information going from the top down, not from the bottom back up that easily. Um so, so that’s the fifth chapter. But if you wanted a company to actually work that way, you’d have to prepare the people in the company to work collaboratively. And that’s what the first four chapters are for. The first chapter is creative, foundation, and caring, which we already talked about.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): You don’t want that classroom experience I had. You want to you want that experience of being rewarded for mistakes so you can bring up what needs to be fixed. And then uh we hire people for what they love to do. So uh so the second one is understand your ruling love and we understand people are made up of many things that they love but but whatever that if you can understand what it is that really lights you up then chapter three is focus on being useful. If you can match what you love to do to what the company needs that’s useful for the customer then now you’ve really got something because now you’re finding life purpose at work. Like now it’s like, you know, the happiest place honestly is going to work because now I get to do what I love to do. And then the fourth one is embrace problems and weakness. So that’s where my company really took off for me. Uh because I, you know, I still have all those learning disabilities I had when I was a kid.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): I still have a terrible memory. I’m not very disciplined, terrible at reading. I’m dyslexic. uh you know hypoglycemic uh people say well if you want to get Glenn’s attention make sure you make sure you get him after 9 after he’s had his coffee, but don’t wait till 11:30 because then he’s at a hypoglycemic low. But don’t wait till 2:00 because then he’s going to be sleepy like it’s nap time, but these little windows. Um, but I have an assistant that helps with my email calendar and we all accept that we all have strengths and weaknesses and we’re trying to help each other. uh before I I tried to hire like I think four different leaders for my company because I thought I’m really not qualified and they each were taking the company in a direction I didn’t want the company to go so I kept taking it over and I thought well I I know I’m not qualified to do this uh but then by inventing this human business model all of a sudden I am qualified because my strength I get to really leverage my strength and my weaknesses that give somebody else a really good living.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): You know, other people make a good living on my weaknesses by helping me. And the and the payoff, the payment,

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Okay.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): The big payment that I get is the people I get to hang out with. Like I have all these people that want to we want to see each other be successful, which is, you know, there’s a they emotional an emotional salary, I guess,

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): All right.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): is really nice.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Yeah. I mean, the journey you’ve embraced with yourself having gone from, you know, being bullied and and that whole story definitely tugged at my heartstrings and but it’s a moving story and you, like you said, you experienced failure so much that that that kind of fear of it didn’t exist

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): because it was just part of your all the time.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): But um and then to to have that recognizing mistakes and like you went through that kind of self journey where you recognized you had dealt with some hard things as a kid and that was impacting how you were approaching leadership and then

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Right. Right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): using that identifying mistakes in your business now to to actually help your business be better like manufacturer level.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Right. Right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): And so I think that’s just such a cool journey to have gone through. And I can tell you from my kids school, I don’t know if this is across the board, but man, that positive reinforcement is like they have drilled into that because my kids, they get candy and prizes like all the time almost to where I’m like, “Okay, where’s the failure in anything?” you know,

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Oh yeah. Well,

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): but I

Glenn Bostock (Guest): yeah. Yeah. Well, that’s true. Yeah, I know. I I right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): they

Glenn Bostock (Guest): I remember complaining to my mentor about my childhood and he said, “Well, where would you be today without that childhood?” and they go, “Well, that’s true. I guess I should thank those bullies because Um yeah. So I have the philosophy like if I was going to give somebody I’d like I’d love to share with you like what I think the what I understand the meaning of all this is uh because I want your listeners to go away with something not just hearing about me.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Um, I think everybody is driven by wanting to look good. They’re worried about their reputation. Everybody’s interested in material things and money things. And everybody truly loves being useful to people. And earlier in my career, I realized I wanted to have a really good reputation with my wife. I wanted her to admire me in a certain way. I wanted my employees to make me the money. After all, they’re human resources. You know, they’re walking around talking about the inventory of people to help make money for me. They’re not supposed to be having a good time. They’re supposed to be making money for me. Everybody knows that we’re here to make money in business and it’s money for the owners. And then and then being useful kind of came in last, you know, and if you if you’re working everybody’s working so hard to have a great reputation and and get the material things they want and then they’ll say, well, I got to do something useful so I can get those things.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): But if you flip it to thinking, well, how can I be useful to my workers? How can I be useful to my wife? And how can I be useful to my customers? All of a sudden reputation and money show up in support of those things. Like I don’t have to obviously you have to charge to be able to perform the useful things that you’re doing. Like it’s part of the recipe and and when people can sense when you’re out

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Right.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): to do something good for them versus uh try to get something from them. And um so I all I would just say if you just put usefulness first, you’ll find everything goes better. Um and and the other big lesson I got is that when I was learning things in school, I thought, well, if you learn enough, then you’ll then you won’t have problems anymore. And now I realized, oh, problems are here for your benefit. Like actually, problems are like going to the gym.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): like you cause a problem for your muscle, right? And you tear your muscle to grow more muscle. Well, that’s you’re you’re you’re going to the gym for that. But luckily at work, the gym comes to us and we get a stream of problems to solve every day that makes us better people. But we could either be miserable and not get the lesson out of the problem or we could, you know, be annoyed at first, but realize the annoyance is kind of like in your body an annoyance is kind of like a pain signal. It’s a signal that something needs attention. And um we could be happy about like oh well okay now I I see that there’s a problem there Now we know we can know that we’re finding the gold. This is how we’re going to grow. So

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): And even those like you’re saying those um identifying things that are not right that’s that

Glenn Bostock (Guest): there,

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): has it has use for the body right it’s that signal of being able to

Glenn Bostock (Guest): All

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): address something so I guess just kind In closing here,

Glenn Bostock (Guest): right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): um do you have any final thoughts for you know HR leaders, people leaders, owners of businesses of where to start with this? Like maybe this is a new concept for people, and they’ve been running and walking with pebbles and rocks in their shoes for a long time. Like how do they or maybe they’ve been using, you know, that kind of coarse behavior towards employees to try to get motivation, right? And maybe they have to make a hair.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): So yeah, where do you

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Right. Um,

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): start?

Glenn Bostock (Guest): I I think that this this it starts with uh it it starts with uh your your own mindset realizing, you know what, maybe I ought to look at how I’ve been looking at work and and what if I what if I put energy into if I could if I could show myself being vulnerable, asking for help, uh making a misstep, and realizing I made life a little miserable, for somebody and apologizing for it and taking responsibility for it all of a sudden you’d find people around you would start doing the same and if you’re in the middle if you if you I think if you have any leadership if you have any influence you can have a lot of influence by rewarding somebody if they make a mistake they’re going to be so shocked the way we started it at SnapC was by giving people gift

Glenn Bostock (Guest): cards just looking for somebody doing something wrong and we gave them a gift card and involved them and u you know the mistake proofing of it and they’re just shocked because they thought they’d be losing their job and instead they’re getting to be part of a solution. So if you can just make that mind shift nobody gets up in the morning wanting to make problems and giving people the respect to assume that they want to be part of a solution u makes a huge difference. Um, I’d buy the book and there’s more in

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Yeah,

Glenn Bostock (Guest): there.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): that’s a great place to start. Just just go read go read what what you’ve already learned over your experience

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Yeah. Yep. Yep. It’ll save you about 20 years of my life.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): and look that’s

Glenn Bostock (Guest): I put in the book. So, I’ll save you 20 years.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): worth a read for sure. Definitely.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Yeah.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): I look back to when Matt and I first got married.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): We went for the summer to do summer sales in California and I took a stab at it and spent a day with a, you know, one of the elite sales guys and got lots of doors slammed in my face and lots of nos and lots of people hating me. I I don’t particularly people knocking on, you know, sales guys knocking on my door either. So, I couldn’t really blame him. But I ended that day just in tears because of how people hate me so much.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): And we went to like a training to be better salespeople and and it was

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): just it went back to let’s just be a doctor for people’s bugs. Like what bug problems are you seeing and how can I help you?

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Right. Right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): And I loved that so much more. I was like, “Oh, like we’re just we’re just trying to go help people. We’re not just trying to get a sale or, you know, like giving the spill of of our sales tactics or whatever just so we can

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): get that sale.” It’s like, is there a way that I can help you? And if not, like, I’ll just move on, you know?

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): So,

Glenn Bostock (Guest): That’s right. That’s

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): I am so good for business.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): It’s good for the bottom line, but it’s also just good for yourself to not feel like you’re

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Mhm.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): or being somebody else, right? You’re just being a real person that’s trying to be useful to someone else.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): That’s right. That’s

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): And I think the perfect way to to close this out and and

Glenn Bostock (Guest): right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): thank you so much, Glenn. It was such a pleasure hear your full experience and and I’m excited to look more into your book

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Sure.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): as well. will include that link to your book on our highlight article as well as your LinkedIn. Please connect with him and yeah,

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Okay.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): stay tuned for the next episode.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): All right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Yep. Everyone read the book.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): Great.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Awesome. Thank you,

Glenn Bostock (Guest): All right.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Glenn.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): All right. Thank

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): Yep.

Glenn Bostock (Guest): you.

Matt & Crista Vance (Hosts): We’ll see everyone next time.